S: Yeah. I don’t know if he liked it, but he saw the logic behind it. Even at this point, I don’t even know if I like it. I like touring, but actually playing shows is kind of a head fuck for me. I get really freaked out before I go on. I got about an hour-and-a-half to two-and-a-half hours of total neurosis, and it’s to the physical point where you can actually feel it. And it makes you think you’re sick or it makes you think you gotta shit… It’s all just mental things. And actually, I got a new theory about that if you don’t mind I’d like to go into… But first, I don’t know necessarily that he likes it. He, like me, likes touring. We like going and exploring these other cities and meeting new people. We like seeing the results of people appreciating our music. We like the opportunity to talk to people and to break barriers so they can see, "Look, I’m just as much a dork as you." So I’m really into breaking apart as much of the dichotomy of the stage as much as possible.

I prefer to just kinda be able to be myself and not worry about what you’re gonna think if I trip over the curb and fall down. You should laugh, because it’s fucking funny."

My band at this point has gotten to a point where we’re playing bigger rooms and I can’t just stand on the fucking floor and rap. But personally, you’re familiar with the 7th Street Entry [in Minneapolis]. That’s how I like shows to be. That’s generally the only time I’m comfortable. The whole last tour I did was in small rooms like that as much as I could. But I have to do these bigger rooms this time because there’s more of a demand and more kids got pissed off that they couldn’t get into the shows last time, so I now have to get off the stage and walk around after the show at least, just to kind of break through that.

I don’t like the whole “Put your head up and stare at me while I look down upon you” thing. I don’t like the feelings I started getting when I first started noticing words like adoration, and idol worship. I’m not trying to be pretentious or any of that shit, but I throw those words, it totally clicks, it makes the most sense. I’m not into all that shit, man. I prefer to just kinda be able to be myself and not worry about what you’re gonna think if I trip over the curb and fall down. You should laugh, because it’s fucking funny. And if I got hurt, you should come over and see if I need help. But they don’t allow people in my position, much less bigger—I can’t even imagine what’s gonna happen when I move from faux-famous to famous, God forbid. But, fuck that. Let’s go back to what I was talking about…

Check this out. All these fucking people are going to the doctor to get these fucking drugs to make them feel less nervous, less anxiety, less abnormal, let’s just say. Probably a pretty common thing. I wanna fuckin’ feel normal like I used to feel when I was 12. Well, talk to me. Well, you’re fucking depressed. Here this will help. Or you have anxiety attacks. Here, here, this will help. Dude, you know what? The type of anxiety I feel before I get on stage is like… Shit, who’s calling… Can you hold for like one second?

(At this point, Slug clicks over to the other line. Another interviewer is calling.)

S: Yeah, that guy was early. Sorry about that.

RP: No problem, you know how much time I have?

S: I had to yell at him. We got like five more minutes. So if I’m fucking you up by talking about, you know, going off… I’m gonna make this real quick. You know that feeling that they get that makes them wanna go get those fucking pills? That feeling is good for them. Don’t take a fucking pill to get rid of it. That’s the feeling that’s nagging at you, telling you that you’re about to do something important, or you need to do something important, or you should go paint a fucking picture. Those feelings have been coming to people forever, it’s just they never… They did self-medicate, but it wasn’t in this condensed, this is exactly how it’s going to make you feel [way]. It was more of a self-medication that allows you to go find your own feeling, such as drugs, like pot, mushrooms, blah-blah-blah… And I’m not trying to say we should legalize drugs. I’m just saying, I’m not really secure with this fucking sedated, complacent, prescribed population that we got going on right now. Anyway, sorry, okay. ‘Cause that’s how I feel before I get on stage. It freaks me the fuck out. It’s almost like being high. It’s almost like going somewhere else. Did you ever see that movie “The Bear” about that little baby bear, there was no words, just that bear?

RP: Yeah. Sad movie.

S: You remember when the bear ate the mushrooms and started freaking out and didn’t know what the fuck was going on?

RP: Yes!

S: Yes! That’s what happens to people, man. Do you perform? Play guitar, bass, drums, rap, DJ?

RP: Yeah, guitar and DJ.

S: Do you get nervous?

RP: Yeah, even just in a room full of like 25 people. Me and my friend, if he’s rapping and I’m playing live…

S: Yeah, even in front of friends. So do you take any prescribed meds? I’m not gonna judge you.

RP: Nope.

"I’m that guy that everybody says makes these whiny, dysfunctional relationship songs. But I realized that a lot of those songs stem from a place in me that actually has a lot more to do with self-medication than it does actually a woman."

S: You’re the man. And I guess that’s my whole theme this tour, and that’s why it’s called “Pour Me Another.” The whole tour is about self-medication. There’s a lot of songs that I’ve realized kind of tie together. You know, I’m that guy that everybody says makes these whiny, dysfunctional relationship songs. But I realized that a lot of those songs stem from a place in me that actually has a lot more to do with self-medication than it does actually a woman. And, um… So, did you have any questions? Haha.

RP: Yeah, I’ll just pop in a couple real quick before you gotta let me go… Since you’re talking about songs coming from deep within you, how do you feel about being lumped together with what they’re calling “emo-rap” or “emo-hop?”

S: I don’t like… Whatever, man. About five, six, seven years ago when I first heard the term, I was defensive. Now I’m like, whatever man. Cats… journalists, rappers, everybody, when you’re explaining something to somebody, you want to be able to do it in the least amount of words possible. You want to paint a picture with the least amount of lines. You want them to get it, especially when they’re ignorant and they don’t know nothing about it. And you’re like, okay, I’ve got 15 seconds to explain it to you. Well, it’s emo-rap. There. I’m not mad at it. I don’t necessarily agree with the term. I don’t agree with separating the branches of the tree of hip-hop. But at the same time, I don’t get mad when they separate the rock shit, so I can’t get mad when the rap critics separate the rap shit. Not only that, but journalists gotta get laid, too. It’s an art, man, and you wanna be the guy at the party full of journalists that everybody goes, “Oh my God, he’s the man. I wanna blow him.” And well, beyond that, it’s an art, and that’s what art is. Art is an alien form of communication that’s been given to us in order to help attract more like-minded people in order to make our swimming pool full of choices of who to procreate with bigger.

Ant and Slug

RP: Me and my friend were interviewing Mr. Dibbs [Atmosphere’s usual DJ] at the Warped Tour 2004.

S: Fuck yeah.

RP: One of the things he mentioned was that “Felt 2” was originally going to be a tribute to Nicole Richie and that you and Murs kinda switched it up on him. Is that accurate?

S: Yeah, it is accurate. We switched it up. We didn’t switch it up on Dibbs. He never had no choice in the matter. But he probably just was like, “Wait. Why didn’t y’all tell me?” It was gonna be to Nicole Richie. But the thing about “Felt” is, the project is supposed to be dedicated to a B-level actress who needs her career kick-started, who we haven’t slept with yet.

RP: Alright, that explains itself.

S: I’m gonna leave it at that.

RP: Do you plan on re-releasing any more Headshots tapes in the coming years?

S: I didn’t even plan on releasing that one. I was against it fully.

RP: Why’s that?

S: Because, man, if we’re gonna sink some resources—'cause there’s only limited resources—and if we’re gonna sink resources into anything, I would prefer to sink it into something new. Even if it’s not mine, I would prefer to sink it into somebody else’s new record. A record coming out, especially for us now, it takes time, effort, energy and some money. Now granted, if it does well, it can bring back the money, but it will never bring back the time and the energy. And my theory is, go download that shit if you want it. In fact, go download it and burn a copy for your friend who doesn’t have the internet.

As far as us putting energy and effort behind it, it wasn’t my favorite idea. I wasn’t so upset with it that I put my foot down and was like, “Fuck no. I’ll steal it. I’m gonna hide the masters.” More so—the masters. It was a fucking four-track record! How ‘bout that? But when they told me that they pressed it to vinyl, I got a little excited, because I was like, I get to make a four-track record on vinyl? That’s some PJ Harvey shit. Look at me. I’m the PJ Harvey of rap now. So that helped, but still, I was against it. The old shit is the old shit, let it go away, and if somebody really, really wants to get their hands on it, they will. We don’t have to throw it out there. Because when I listen to that shit, I cringe. Like wow, did I just say "ho?" Fuck. Even tongue-in-cheek, even when I was being sarcastic when saying a lot of the shit I said on that record, it was still kinda harsh. I think about it now and go, “Man, I would never play that one for my kid.”

RP: Am I out of time here?

S: Well, we’ll keep going ‘til he calls.

RP: Cool. Speaking of your kid, how would you feel about Jacob going into rapping?

S: I would try to deter him from going into music in general, but if he wants to, I would never be against it. But personally… And I don’t mean, let’s push him towards sports instead. I would prefer to push him toward communicating, and not necessarily communicating through music, but more so through speaking, through talking. If I had my way, that’s what I would want for him. But granted, being that that’s what I want, that’s exactly the opposite of what he’s going to do. So if he goes into music, so be it, hey, I got some knowledge for him. I’ve gained a few things here and there along the way that could possibly be helpful for him to know. So if that be the case, so be it. But you know, I wouldn’t really suggest to any of my friends or anybody really, really, try to do this. People that do it, I think, know they gotta do it or know they wanna to do it. Otherwise, it’s kind of a heart-breaking thing to go do. My life was a lot more sunny when I was a courier.

"I was the class clown in school, so I was that dude in the back beating my head against the chalkboard for no reason. I think it was just kind of a natural progression for me."

RP: So when did you realize it was something you wanted to do?

S: I don’t know, when I was a kid. I just didn’t realize I actually realistically could. But I was rapping for no apparent fucking reason for like 10 years, at parties, in circles, at other people’s shows. I was just trying to get props, I loved attention, I loved people hearing me… I was the class clown in school, so I was that dude in the back beating my head against the chalkboard for no reason. I think it was just kind of a natural progression for me. I had to figure out a way to get people to look at me and to listen. Rapping seemed to work because I studied so much of it and loved it so much, it made the most sense, but hell. I could be that guy standing outside of Wendy’s wearing a chicken suit, jumping up and down, trying to get you to come in and try the new mesquite chicken sandwich.

RP: Las Vegoose festival. You looking forward to that?

S: I am, because I haven’t seen Primus since they were on Lollapalooza 15 years ago. But I’m nervous as fuck, you know what I mean? I’m playing on a stage with a lot of people that I consider to be incredible, incredible rappers.

RP: Right between Blackalicious and [Talib] Kwelie, right?

S: Yeah. And I’m definitely nervous. I appreciate my position in all of this, but I’m still pretty neurotic about it, and there’s always that part of me that in the back of my mind wonders if, like, Talib looks at me like I’m part of the fuckin’ problem with hip-hop, you know what I mean?

RP: Interesting.

S: Man, it all comes back to the fact that A, I’m a self-medicator, B, I’ve always had this “I want your attention” complex, even since I was a kid. I don’t know. Maybe I didn’t get enough love from my drugged-up parents. I don’t know. That’s a joke. Kind of.

RP: Well, good luck on the tour. I’ll see you up at the Eugene, Oregon, show on November 4.

S: Eugene. Is that at the WOW [a venue in Eugene]?

RP: Yeah, I think. [I was mistaken—it was at the McDonald Theatre.]

S: Oh, God.

RP: Not a cool place?

S: No, it’s really cool. It’s just that every time we play there, there is some kind of tragic episode for somebody in the van. No longer me—I’ve figured out how to keep my life kinda regulated, but it’s gonna be like, that’s the night that P.O.S.’s girlfriend is gonna dump him or something. Over the phone. Anyway, sweet… maybe I’ll see you then.